How would you like a gypies site in calne

Local lass · How would you like a gypies site in calne

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/wiltshire/7359847.stm

http://www.gazetteandherald.co.uk...t_to_be_considered_by_council.php
heard this on the radio .one would be in oxford road and the other down abbered.lane

although not a final discision i hope they do not come.

Martin Peck

We had uproar for several years about one being opened just outside Bridgwater. It was built and no gypsies use it .
Martin

Robert Baggs

I object to this as I live in Oxford Road and both proposed sites are a stone's throw from my house. I have already been contacted by local residents and businesses asking what can be done about it. "The dot" has already ensured my house is losing value, it will lose more and the security in the area will need stepping up!

I have emailed Calne Town Councillors, (those whose email addresses are on the Calne Town Council web-site) and also local MPs asking for their views on this and, if they object, what they propose to do about it. I will update if I hear more.

There is, I am told, a meeting at North Wilts District Council offices tomorrow night at which this may be discussed.

Best wishes

Robert

Robert Baggs

Further details can be found here:-

http://www.northwilts.gov.uk/news-article.htm?newsid=50011

Robert

Bear

What is this world coming to once again we are cowtowing to a minority who believe they have a right to a camp site. I am not a gypsy whatever that is or a traveller so would I be able to park my caravan up there for free. I think not therefore I would have go to a campsite and pay the owner for the privilege which is what these wastes of space should do. Get a job pay taxes and help those who truly need help not a bunch of scrounging b*?(ar*. That wont something for nothing I give up on this country I think I will emigrate

Local lass

certainly dont want here .and why are we paying for it??????

this has to be stopped

Robert Baggs

I have had further confirmation today that the favourite site is the Oxford Road one - I am obtaining a copy of the report which apparently is very biased towards this site and will update in due course.

Alledgedly there are also some very shady dealings going on between NWDC and Humberts, the estate agent!

And what will NWDC spend the £250,000 grant provided for this on?

Robert Baggs

The Reports on the sites can be found here

http://www.northwilts.gov.uk/inde...es_reports_executive_24_04_08.htm

Top Dog

what can be done to get this stopped Robert ?

Robert Baggs

A concerted effort by the people of Calne to protest and make it clear to our councillors and those at NWDC that they do not want this.

The unfortunate thing is that it seems the decision has already been made except for the planning approvals etc. as evidenced by the lack of awareness that this was happening until 2 days before a meeting to discuss it. Even if Calne Town councillors object to any planning application NWDC councillors can over-ride it, as has happened in the past.

I am concerned that the apathy shown at elections will not help with any campaign that is organised but I am sure there are things we can do.

A friend of mine has written the following which gives some hope all is not lost. Unfortunately I am unable to get to the meeting tonight to read this:-

OBJECTION TO PROPOSAL FOR PERMANENT GYPSY / TRAVELLER SITE AT CALNE (SITE 2).

The council officers have proposed the undervalue disposal of a piece of land at Oxford Road, Calne for the location of a gypsy / traveller site.

I would like to raise objection to this site being considered for development as a residential site for gypsies on the following grounds:

The officer is recommending that the council dispose of its freehold interest in the site subject to contract. The report highlights that this disposal will be at an undervalue financially. The council, via it’s land agent, has received a first approach from a North Wiltshire based business that is keen to expand its operations and is seeking land on which to do so. The owners of the business have identified this patch of land as most suitable for their needs and would bring increased employment opportunities to the town of Calne. The business is very unlikely to further its plans to locate to this site or any nearby land if it is located within easy reach of a gypsy / traveller site. The land is allocated as employment land in the Local Plan and should remain so, in order to capitalise on business opportunities for the employment benefit of the people of North Wiltshire.

The report hints that it will be relatively easy to reallocate dedicated employment land for the purpose of what is essentially housing. This makes a mockery of the local planning system controls.

The officer is recommending that no action be taken on any other site at the present time and that only Site 2 be moved forward. It would appear that, as far as officers are concerned, the decision is made.

The report (sec 3.2) states that the land survey highlighted six public and nine private sites in the district that may be suitable and that the survey is recent (1.1). Yet in paragraph 3.3 the officer seeks to push councillors to ignore the potential of the 9 private sites and the report pushes for decision on Site 2, Calne. The report attempts to rush members into a decision, rather than fully and exhaustively investigating the potential of all sites identified by the survey. Members should reject this report and refer it back to the officers for further investigation.

Site 2 is an undeveloped green field, allocated as employment land. The siting of a traveller camp on the land will not only bring in less money to the council than using it for employment use, but has the potential to create an eyesore on what is, after all, a main entrance to the second largest market town in North Wiltshire. The site is not Brownfield nor untidy or derelict land (3.1 point 6), – surely there must be a more suitable patch of land within the district that can actually be “enhanced” by a site development.

Point 3.1 (11) – there is no mention of assessment of any sites currently tolerated by the local planning authority. The report should make it clear whether there are existing unauthorised traveller sites in the district and whether these have been assessed and can be made suitable using the grant aid from Government.

I am sure that there are many more people here that have an objection to the principle of North Wiltshire land being sold undervalue for the rushed development of a traveller site. This is, of course, a very sensitive and difficult decision for members to make. I plead with you not to rush into any decision that fails to fully explore the full number of potential sites and which will have such an affect on the local population. The report is not comprehensive and should be referred back to the officers for further investigation.

The old adage “decide in haste, repent at leisure” seems quite appropriate here. Don’t let your electors down.

All I suggest is that we see what happens at tonights meeting and what NWDC plan next and then look at how we can mount a campaign to prevent this happening. Leafletting all homes and businesses in the area with properly prepared information would be a useful start. This can be actioned quickly and under a non-political banner as there is more at stake than political brownie points. Anyone know a good and cheap (or even free!) printer?

Top Dog

Robert are you against the sites on the whole in calne or is it just because it is right on your doorstep?

Local lass

robert wrote
All I suggest is that we see what happens at tonights meeting and what NWDC plan next and then look at how we can mount a campaign to prevent this happening. Leafletting all homes and businesses in the area with properly prepared information would be a useful start. This can be actioned quickly and under a non-political banner as there is more at stake than political brownie points. Anyone know a good and cheap (or even free!) printer?

i would be more than willing to do a leaflet drop.
prehaps some of the local buissness in calne would help out with printing.
this really needs to be stopped .
the councillours need to unite and protect calne .
if you do want any help just pm me.

Robert Baggs

Top Dog

I would agree ,calne is not the place for these sites.
If we can help in anyway on this forum just let me know.

Robert Baggs

Report from the Wiltshire Gazette web-site

http://www.thisiswiltshire.co.uk/...meeting_over_travellers_sites.php

LEADER of North Wiltshire District Council Dick Tonge was forced to call security when a meeting about gypsy and traveller sites got out of hand last night.
The council's executive committee met last night to discuss the controversial issue of providing sites for gypsies in the district.
The meeting was well attended by members of the public and gypsies from the site in Minety who all demanded to know why they had not been informed about the council's plans.
It was revealed on Monday that the council had been given £250,000 by the government to provide suitable sites for travellers.
Over all 24 pitches have to be provided in North Wiltshire for travellers and six sites were identified by estate agents Humberts, who were commissioned to prepare a report.
The potential sites in North Wiltshire included two in Calne, one in Wootton Bassett and up to three in Chippenham.
A flurry of booing and heckling got out of control and Coun Tonge called security threatening to close the meeting. But the crowd calmed when a security man appeared.
Sophie Fearnley-Whittingstall received a round of applause when she asked why the report had been confidential saying residents deserved to know what was planned for land near their homes.
Councillor Alison Bucknall was booed when she responded saying: "I am at a loss to know how we are able to inform every single individual resident in North Wiltshire.
"We are damned if we do and damned if we don't. The report was on the website and it has been in the press."
Speaking on behalf of the gypsy community, one traveller from the site in Minety said: "You are talking about us like we are cattle and like we mean nothing.
"We are disgusted. This is all because you want to move the Minety travellers.
"This is what all the rushing is about. To get us out. We are five years settled."
The Minety gypsies are due to go to appeal in July against the council's decision to evict them within 18 months.
Eventually Councillor Howard Greenman, lead member for housing, offered a U-turn when he suggested the original report be scrapped and the council consult the public before choosing any land.
"The need to provide these sites has been put upon us with some speed and haste," he said.
"The fact that we were under huge time pressures made it all the more worse.
"Having said that I am not comfortable with the report before us this evening.
"We do need to go out to proper public consultation and as a result all the report I see before me this evening is going to be deleted."
Councillors then agreed to reconsider a site in Marlborough Road in Wootton Bassett after it was discounted and to carry out a six-week public consultation.

Peter Dolman

The action by the District Council in trying to push through the decision on where to site the travellers site is reprehensible. There has been not public consultation and it would appear from the debate reported by Robert Baggs that Councillor Bucknall did not want us to have a say.

We as residents of Calne have a legal right to be involved in any decision about where to put this site. If the District Council do not carry out consultation, then we (local residents) would have the right to challenge the decision in court.

There is a problem in that District Councils & County Councils are legally required to provide these sites but everyone objects to having them in their "back yard".

I object to the Oxford Road site on 2 points.
Firstly this site is on a major road into Calne and would give visitors a poor 1st impression of the town. The proposed access of the roundabout would create a traffic hazard.

Secondly the whole of the land from the bypass roundabout to the Bug & Spider has been purchased and is likely to be subject to a planning application. This is under discussion for many years and would be prefered to a travellers site.

I cannot support this proposal although I am sympathetic for the need of authorised traveller sites.

Top Dog

for leaflets posters.
http://www.digiprintchippenham.co.uk/

GTB

A lot of people see travellers as nothing more than overly mobile social vermin who do nothing for society but steal and cheat. I have had dealings with some of their clan in the past few years where my builders yard and the main yard (which belongs to a landlord) has been targeted many times by these people who have stolen countless litres of diesal and stolen every vehicle my Landlord owned - three lorries and a Transit tipper plus other valuable tools. They stole a crane lorry from the yard, removed the crane and dumped the lorry across the road from their camp in the North of Wiltshire. This has happened twice now where the vehicle has been recovered from this camp but the police are powerless to act because of lack of eveidence because nobody would make a statement. They are so sure of themselves that they won't get caught they blatantly leave these vehicles where they like after they have stripped them of want they need.

Do Calne really want these sort of people to move in next to them - not that they are getting a choice, so it seems. I would have thought that the managers of the local business' that live near to the proposed site would have liked the option of a democratic vote because their insurance premiums will surely rise if this lot move in.

Hoping to integrate these sort of people into civilised society where they pay taxes and keep their noses clean is the same level of hope as trying to win the lottery. The dishonesty of them is so ingrained that it would take several generations to wash it out of them. I know that we have to do something towards rehabilitating them but short of putting them in chains I am at a loss.

kathy27

:? is it me having a blonde moment! isnt the whole point of being a gypsy or traveller, that you opt out of the rat-run, hence no council tax or such like ......why do they want to settle anywhere and are they going to be paying council tax??

rosco

pimpdriver

how about:

Signs on the "Calne" town signs (as you enter Calne from Wootton Bassett, Chippenham and Marlborough) on big bill boards saying:

Do you want a gypsies / travellers site in Calne?
Visit calnetalk.com and join the protest

Then have an effective co-ordinated approach, rather than coming on here moaning about it.

Leaflet drop Lansdowne Park and other "affluent" areas and get the middle class wound up. A lot of people have spent a lot of money on houses round here, to get out of the big city rat race mentality, and live "in the country", I am sure they would be all too pleased to help stop these "travellers / gypsies" moving in.

They have probably taken Wootton Bassett off the list cos the people there are "posh" ("we live in 'Bassett' donchaknow") and have french markets and ride horses.

Calne is fantastic and we want to keep it that way.

Get the boards out and start painting / printing.......

Top Dog

This forum will help in any way it can to stop them from coming to the town.
As long as it is legel.

iamelliot

I've posted a small article on Calne.org.uk and linked it to the discussion here, hopefully that will bring some more awareness from local people too.

http://www.calne.org.uk/blog/gypsy-traveller-site

Top Dog

Thank you iamelliot.We need to get as many people aware of this so it can be stopped.

Local lass

from what i heard they are doing this to strenthen there case for them to get out of minty.

what i want to know is if they build a gypsie site could i go and park a caravan up there all year rent free?????

it would seem the favourite site is oxford road where there is no sewage system and would they provide all of that?

if this does go ahead and i really hope it dosnt the cost of housing in the area will go down,crime will go up.at all off are expence?

and for what Evil Mind

Local lass

wooten basset has the same problem

Top Dog

Whats the latest on this?

Chepfer

The council have has to do a u turn on there decision ..... a public consultation process has been proposed , it is then that all your views will count !

Local lass

Top Dog

Would it be wise to get a petition over this before the next meeting?

Chepfer

I think that would be a good idea !. It can only help the cause !

Peter Dolman

Do we know yet what form the public consultation will take and how individuals can be included in the process?

Top Dog

Not yet we do not.
It seems Chippenham are already having meetings and petitions,as is Wooten basset.

Peter Dolman

I understand that Calne Town Council are holding an emergency Town Council meeting this Thursday 8th May at 6:45.

Members of the public have a 15 minute slot before the meeting starts to make any statements.

I would suggest that anyone wishing to speak (its not diffilcult honest) should either contact the Town Clerk at Bank House (next to Barclays Bank) prior to the meeting to register that they want to speak or get to the meeting early and register then. You don;t have to register but there may be many people who want to!

Top Dog

Is there any updates about the sites?

Top Dog

SAW TODAY THAT SOME GYPSIES HAVE MOVED INTO STANLEY Roll eyes

Chepfer

A petition has been started !. The people living at Pen Hill have started it and i think it's going in the usual shops around calne !

Tracey114 · Calne Proposed Gypsy Site

I have just been informed today that the buyers of my house which is for sale in Oxford Road, Calne have pulled out because of the proposed gypsy site.

The estate agents have informed me that house sales in this area are going to be extremely difficult, so not only will our homes be de-valued they are going to be impossible to sell.

GTB

I would have thought that having a travellers camp within a mile of your property would be very detrimental to the price of your house - and have an effect on your insurance within a year or so (house/car insurances are based partly on your postcode).

pimpdriver

Top Dog

Quite agree pimp driver.

Calnetalk strongly oppose the site.
We are starting a petition.
We as a town need to work together and stop this from happening.
I will draw up the petition today.
If any one would like to help me please pm me.
We need to show the council that we do not want this.
Once we start the petion and the wheels are in motion,We will sort out a meeting..
From what i belive we have just under 6 weeks.In that time we need to get as many signitures as possible.

This is the time when the people of calne need to unite before it is to late.

Robert Baggs

I have just up-date my blog with what I know on this. I am unable to attend the meeting tomorrow due to a prior commitment so I hope plenty of you will be there to register your views and also pass details of what happens on to the wider world.

sophy

I was at the meeting last night. Unfortunately at times it got quite heated with many people directing their anger at the Town Council, when what they are actually trying to do is represent the people of Calne and put forward the best rebuttal they can to the proposals from NWDC.

Let's not forget that the situation with the gypsies has arisen as a result of a directive from central government.

We stand the best chance of preventing the site being in Calne by working together to come up with some sensible planning reasons why it is not a suitable place for this site.

The town council have set up a working group which will look into the impact on Calne's infrastructure -- schools and healthcare, businesses, property prices, policing, etc.

I am confident that they will put in the hard work that is needed to produce a report for NWDC demonstrating why a gyspy site would be detrimental to the town, particularly in light of the current regeneration, which is being funded by NWDC money.

It is also important that members of the public write to NWDC to give their views which should be based on planning considerations and the impact on the town rather than on prejudicial views about the travellers community. These can be emailed to lrobertson@northwilts.gov.uk with a copy to the Calne town clerk lroberts@calne.gov.uk.

Full details can be found on the north wilts website at www.northwilts.gov.uk/gypsyconsultation

Top Dog

.

Harris

I attended last nights gipsy site meeting and listened intently to the comments and responses that were made. Councillor Hill told us that he and the people sat with him were seeking the views of Calne and they would use these views to write a report to the District Council. He also said that he and the rest of the Councillors always bent over backwards to represent Calne’s electorate; however, his/their track record clearly demonstrates that this statement is just not true.

Last week, the British Legion presented the Council with an ongoing petition that had canvassed 5.5% of Calne. Almost 100% of those people had signed the petition asking the Council to fly the Union Flag daily from the Town Hall flag pole to show support for our troops abroad. Following the presentation, Councillor Hill voted against the wishes of his electorate because he personally didn’t think much of the Union Flag. Councillor Venton (sat far right last night) also voted against the electorate’s wishes proclaiming that the people of Calne may not have understood what they were signing and some would sign anything to get people of their doorstep! (This appeared to be a common view displayed by a number of Councillors so don’t rely on the petition). Councillor Viner told last weeks meeting that he should vote to do as the electorate wished him to and then voted against their wishes. Councillor Ramsey, the only person sat at the table last night who had prepared and researched and the only one therefore able to give reasoned and full responses to questions from the floor, was also the only Councillor sat at the table last night to have voted in accord with the wishes of Calne’s electorate the previous week. Unfortunately, last week she was out voted.

A member of the public was in possession of a printed copy of an email from Councillor Viner which stated that the Council would fight the proposed sites. Viner said that he hadn’t authorised the email and the man responded well, its got your name on the bottom! This email had been sent before consultations with Calne had begun and therefore could not have represented Calne’s views. However, the position was in line with the public in the room.

Unfortunately, again looking at the Council’s track record, they had voted by a majority in accord with the electorate over the flag issue last month and then some had changed their minds and voted against the electorates wishes last week (Viner was one of those who voted in favour last month and then against last week). The Council’s current position was not based on Calne’s views and the fact that at the moment it aligns with ours does not mean it will remain that way.

Another gentleman asked the councillors why they had let problems become a crisis that the public need to become involved with yet again and cited the leisure centre as another example (yet another was the grave yard issue).

We must make every effort to make sure that these Councillors absolutely have to represent our views and are unable take another position in the future should they change their views. However, what we really need is for these Councillors to start serving the people of Calne as they promised they would when they canvassed us for our votes at the last election. If they do not change and continue as their track record demonstrates then it is impossible to tell whether they will in fact represent us over this issue or indeed any other that they again neglectfully allow our town to fall into in the future.

Top Dog

Harris with alll due respect.It was also said at the meeting last night that "it is not important how we got here,The fact of the matter is that we are here".
He is right.
Despite what anyone thinks of the council we have to work together with them to help stop these sites from going ahead.
We could spend the next 5 weeks arguing with them on how they have served calne,at the end of the day it will get us no where.

Where as if we work together ,in five weeks we the public and the council can present the best report on why we should not have the sites in calne.

Harris

Morning Top Dog! I completely agree that right now we need to be moving forward from where we find ourselves. The main point I am making above is not over examining how we got here with the gipsy site issue but over how we make sure the Councillor’s have no way of representing any other view than that of the majority of Calne. Their continuing track record up to and including the rather embarrassing email from Viner is irrefutable evidence that contrary to the comments made by Hill most of our Councillors (including Hill and Viner) do not take the views of their electorate into account when making decisions for Calne, they do what they want. My comment

Top Dog

abitmuch

I need my driveway done...let them come!

yocal local

Chepfer

I feel the councillors of calne do an outstanding job and if it were not for them, we'd still be living in the drab lifeless town that it was, a decade ago.

The town looks great, we have a fantastic sports centre, a new sports complex being built, a youth centre thriving and a new town centre in progess. Plus the tidy streets and beautifull flower show at the moment ..........

"Abitmuch" from september onwards planning permission will be required to put any driveway on your property (except gravel) i'd get it done sooner rather than later, to avoid the extra costs.

abitmuch

custardpoint · Travellers site

I commute into bath often and have the pleasure of viewing the "Thingley Junction" travellers site, just outside Chippenham from the train, whilst there is a fence around the site it obviously isn't high enough as their mess extends to the fields adjacent to the site, it's not uncommon to see smashed up vehicles, and general detritus scattered about.
If Calne is to raise its image, a travellers site on it's front door step (Oxford road) is not going to help, how many other towns have that sort of welcome to visitors?.

Harris

Top Dog

Harris Mondays meeting had nothing to do with the Calne council.
That was N.w.d.c Area five..It was N.w.d.c who conducted that meeting.

Sticky

Harris,

Why not start a separate campaign about the union flag? I have seen a few comments and specifically about one flip flop councillor saying one thing and doing another. (Shock horror)
Lets get a proper campain going so we can gather support and momentum so we force these people to represent us properly!

Local lass

there was a petition about the flag but the council didnt take much notice about it. Evil

Harris

How would you like a gypies site in calne

Calne Proposed Gypsy Site

Travellers site